Leaders in Lending
Leaders in Lending

Episode 60 · 4 months ago

Building Systems Around Member Experiences to Retain Loyalty

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Member loyalty isn’t what it used to be. 

Once upon a time, loyalty was the product of proximity, or due to a family or friend recommendation. 

But loyalty has changed. It’s gone from loyalty to a provider, to loyalty to an experience. 

On this episode of Leaders in Lending, we sit down with Rick Jarrar. Rick is the Chief Lending Officer at Kemba Financial Credit Union, and our conversation was all about: 

  • How to gain and retain member loyalty
  • The evolution of the branch from transactional to advisory services
  • The surge in BNPL payments and its impact
  • The applications of cryptocurrency

To hear more from Leaders in Lending, check us out on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or on our website

Listening on a desktop & can’t see the links? Just search for Leaders in Lending on your favorite podcast player.

You're listening to leaders and lending from upstart, a podcast dedicated to helping consumer lenders grow their programs and improve their product offerings. Each week here, decision makers in the finance industry offer insights into the future of the lending industry best practices around digital transformation. In more let's get into the show. Welcome to leaders and lending. I'm your host, Jeff Keldner. This week's episode features my conversation with Rip Gerar this chief lending officer Kenba credit. Youne. I love talking to Rick. Camba shares a home with our second headquarters in Columbus, Ohio, and we really dove into a lot of interesting topics, including how you think about loyalty and a digital age, the role of branches. Rick kind of phrase that we should be digital first, but not digital only, which I really liked, and he really focus on providing quality. Would called pleasant experience on that being the starting point for lots of discussions of digital, not digital, a kind of how you build technology. We even doven to Crypto at the end, which I thought was really interesting. So please enjoy this conversation with Rick Gerar Rick. Thanks for making the time and joining the podcast to day. I really appreciate it. My pleasure. Thank you, Jeff. I'm glad to be here. Yeah, you guys share a physical location in Columbus, not at not an office space, but I know we have our second home in Columbus and you guys are Columbus base. I've been to your office has so I love the the Ohio connection. It's a great town. It is Columbus is a he's a beautiful city. I'm happy to be here. I've only been here from at seven, maybe eight months since moving from from Memphis, but tell you, it's an awesome so far and your office it's in a great part of Columbus. A lot of a lot of good food around is. There's a lot of good food, good good places to go eat or grab a drink. It's it is a fun it's a fun town and a fun part of that. I've been there a few times and enjoyed it absolutely. We're loving it. Yeah, I thought I'd start the conversation off with the question of loyalty and how you think about you know what it was historically. Maybe we'll start with the kind of like the the status quo or the old version of what earned you loyalty as a financial institution, you know, over time with customers in the past, and then we can dive into how you think that maybe that shifting in a digital age, if it's shifting. But like what do you think was was the core of what caused a consumer to be loyal to a particular financial institution? Jeffinity in the old days in my son laughs at me every time I say that. In the old days loyalty really was a product of locality and a friend or a family member referral. You wanted to do business with a bank or some kind of a you know another business, another retailer, usually found somebody who was nearby and you asked the rout. Well, I mean today we sort of still do the same thing when we look at Google reviews right for the valuate a business. But you know we, let me take a stuff back a little bit. We as bankers or financial institution, exact it...

...is? We've three years talked about increasing the share of wallet, you know, customers, members, whatever. If you look at your own wallet, if I work to pull on my own wall at now, I'm living to bet that you have cards from three or four different institutions and I think one of the things that we will, as bankers, have to have to accept is that is it okay, or contemplate, is it okay for for our members to do business with three or four different institutions? Why is it that we insist that we become the primary financial institution? Maybe we need to consider changing that first pee from primary to permanent, meaning if I am a great auto financer, if I'm not a great auto under and I've got members that are borrowed money for me to buy cars for the last ten or fifteen years, what is wrong with that? Maybe that's a concept that we need to understand. So, and shifting back to your question of loyalty, loyalty has shifted to where it is now a loyalty to an experience rather than a service provider. If you look at and if you look at a company like facebook, facebook taught us many, many years ago that you could have a relationship with somebody or a friendship with somebody who you have never ever met. It could be a person in China that you've never met and you never ever go into me. You've never had a conversation with them and you never going to have a conversation with them, but you still call this person a friend and you still maintain the relationship with them of some sort. What is wrong with taken that concept and applying give to the financial services industry? You know, I talked about the loyalty to the experience that there's plenty of recent research that proves that point. You look at Amazon, for example, and you know I sort of threw this around a little bit before, amazons prices are not the cheapest, they're competitive, but they provide a great customer experience every single time. If your product is late, they're transparent. They tell you the product is late and if you ask, they'll even compensate you for that delay. So again, what if we, as financial institutions, aimed at relationships or began to look at relationships as a single product? And I know if my boss heard me say there's he would probably yell at me, you know, because we, along with all other institutions, are all about engagement and roll about having multiple products. But if we were to give members, if we were to give consumers the option, the choice to choose where they want to pick their products, if every institution or if we employed the hedgehog concept, meaning identify what you do best and do it better than anybody else. Then the member or the consumer would end up having the best experience really in just about every product that they could potentially want to want to buy. So you know there's there's loyalty programs. Really, if you think about them, unless you do them at the scale of American Express, they're tough. But...

...even if you look at those things, they are a single product loyalty program. American Express doesn't expect you to financier your house whe then with the by life and trance possy front them. So you know, we as financial institution still want that multi product relationship and we can have it if we can create an experience that the member would be loyal to in every product that the that we could potentially develop. So you know, in summary, in my view the concentration of the focus really should be by the institutions if we want to create true loyalty, is to focus on the experience that the member goes through to get any product that we have, not necessarily the pricing and not necessarily any any other component. I think the experience, and we've learned this from, you know, the introduction of the iphone. All the way to, you know, the end of the of the coronavirus pandemic, where they experience has really determined which business has survived in which businesses they not survive. Yeah, that's really fast and I'd love to dive into what you think differentiates the high quality experience. But I do want to ask this first, because your message is really want a little bit of like focus on the thing that you're going to be really good. I mean that hedgehog concept. I love. I've I've read that book many times and this idea of like focusing on what you can be best in the world at and not trying to be all things all people. It runs countered, I think, how many financial institutions have operated and frankly, the book that most of the Challenger banks are neo banks are taking, which is what I see from at least some of them, out all of them, but is a rush to have as many products available as possible, often at the cost of a poorly integrated experience, you know, poorly optimized experience, maybe a lot of outsource saying where there's like a lots of pieces that are kind of like not great, but hey, we've got to have we've got to be able to do the home by and the car by and the line of Credit and the personal loan and the Credit Card and the deposit, and so they're getting a lot of breath but maybe not the optimal experience. So I love to get your take on how you think about picking what is your key focus, the you know, from that Hedgehog, where you really want to differentiate then what it takes to be what it means to be the best in class experience to in this kind of more digital, at least digitally facilitated age. Sure do look at they look at the evolution of fintext the thing that has made fntex as popular as they are today is the experience, is the is the journey. That is a consumer journey. When fin text first came on the scene, you know we call them disruptors, they were seen as a big threat. I'll tell you what, I thought they would the greatest thing to ever come on to the financial services industry from day one and I didn't see it, it seems, see them as a threat when I saw what I would have to go through to take a person alone from, you know, my local bank or savings alone, or putting you and you know whatever, compared to what I would do if I were to go to upstart, clearly it's night and day. And when...

...you look at that and you compare those two experiences, it's it is easily you can tell who the winner is going to be in the long run. Take take the the let us talk about fent tax. You know, I'll start in particular. Short application, very, very little friction, not invasive, at least not on the front end when we're getting information from the member and the member is done. Compare that to a traditional person alone, unsecured, personal alone experience through a bank. You know, five years ago you have to, you know, practically give your firstborn. It very, very, very different. So when we talk about experience and we would talk about the member journey, it's all about providing the consumer with what they want, how they want it and where they wanted and when they want asking the member to complete an application that has forty five fields to get a personal loan or a car loan or even a mortgage. These days it's ridiculous. The journey that consumer experience has to be so streamlined that it has to be literally pleasant. The consumer should be able to get online and I'll tell you I'm you know, I preach about this so much at Kemba that I think people are either really really jumping along for the coming along for the ride, whether getting tired of me, you know, seeing in the song. They the my expectation is my member is going to get online, apply for a loan and then look at their spouse and say what is that it? And then the second piece of it, of course, is that we get them whatever they need, whether it's money or credit card whatever, without them having to pick up the phone, without anybody having to pick up the phone and saying, Hey, did you do this? And here's what we need to know. There's no he's what we need to do, here's what I'm the consumer, here's what I want, here's what I wanted, and he's where I want it. One of the things that I personally dream about, Jeff, is to give to a point where I can, while I'm sitting in bed on Sunday morning, I can stick my head up and say, Alexa, I want to buy a two thousand and nineteen coach R v, find one for me and find me financing and that's it. And I think in a number of years we could potentially give to that point. And so you talk about the number experience. Do I like going down to target every once in a while and walk down aisles? Sure, yeah, I do, I guess, just to just to have some human interactions, especially, you know, coming out of Covid community. But you know, the member experience really has to be you know, Stephen Jobs said it best. He said, you know, find out what your customer wants and then build around that. Don't go buy a system and then and and begin to implement it and say, well, let's see how you know, we we can make this work for our for our customers, and it doesn't work that way. You've got to identify what the number wants and then build everything that you do, whether it's...

...systems or processes or even talent, around what your customer base is. It's all in my view, it is all about the customer experience these days. I love that message and I feel like it's one that gets lost sometimes. I get this. You know, the topic of digitization is is top of mine forever. I feel like every want to talk about going digital and I've seen digital experiences that didn't have this mindset where I went to my bank and they gave me the same forty five questions as if I was a guy walking up on the street. And I say these are you're asking me about like you to call me about a mortgage refin and you're asking me where the dress of the home is, like right, you know that. You know this is I'm responding to your mail and you're asking me my name and my date of birth and like you've got to like they got the digital check box, but they didn't focus on delivering that kind of easy, seem less, you know, pleasant, if you will, member experience, and I feel like that's it's a great message because it's so often gets forgotten and the rush to be quote unquote digital, that you know, digital is not just like yes or no. There's there's a quality of experience element that you really have to think about getting right if you want to earn business from consumers these days. Absolutely, if we were trying to catch to cancel a change of flight, online the option, but it's it's a pain, it really is. It's a pain and it's not a pleasant experience. You can book easily online, but if you need to make any changes, it's not a pleasant experience and I think that's something that, you know, the airline industry is going to have to look at at some point in the future. Our, God forbid, you have to cancel, not a flight like try and cancel a subscription like the number. I feel like there should be a law against allow me to sign up for a script subscription online and unless I can cancel it just as easily online. But they're often like please call US eight hundred number. Way Thirty minutes on a hold, the cancel the subscription you sign up for in thirty seconds and I go that doesn't seem like a good experience. Yeah, how do you think about the role of the physical presence? We talked about you guys being in Columbus and there our physical office. We still have them. I'm assuming you still have branches and physical presences. We talked about this kind of frictionalist experience that's really digitally facilitated. How do you think about the role of the brick and mortar experience, the branch experience, for the modern consumer? Jeff me, can the in the s? I believe, not not, that I was working the seven these when ATMs first came out. You know, people say, Hey, this is the death of the branch and this is the death of the color position. Fast forward, Internet came on to see and online banking came on to see and the people said, Hey, here was the death of the of the of the branch. That the physical branch there's still around. I think digital the way to look at the digital strategy is not to say digital only. You've got to go digital first, but you have to augmented with a human touch. Again, I gave the example of, you know, if you needed to change a flight or cancel a flight or a matter or subscription, like you mentioned the...

...there are a lot of things that you still cannot do exclusively online. Price Waterhouse Coopers. They aren't. Survey back in two thousand and nineteen, obviously before the pandemic, that showed that sixty percent of consumers still want to tea, to get in touch with a human when they're dealing with a complex products such as a mortgage. Lung branches have evolved over the years. I don't think you could walk into a branch anywhere in the world today, into a five thousand square foot branch with a huge pillars and you know, the huge offices and the huge mahogany desks. They've evolved to where there are lots smaller now and if you notice, every three or four years there's a new phase. You know, we have worked, and I worked overseas for a number of years and back and I want to say two thousand and nine, the bank that I always would experimented with a complete, one hundred percent digital branch, no human interaction. We had an ATM that could print check books and that could issue cashier's checks. We have truly sophisticated equipment. We had ipads all over the place so customers could command and do whatever it is that they that they wanted to do. But that was not enough. We found out that at some point we had to put a at least one employee there who would sit there and just ask questions or at the very least teach people how to use this technology. So exclusive digital has worked for some organizations. I mean there's a there's one fourteen and fifteen billion dollar credit union out of Illinois, I think it's alliant. Even they have one branch and they're doing it well. So obviously they you know, they figured out the secret. I think digital first is the way to go, but it has to be augmented by by a human interaction of some sort. I think branches will continue to serve a purpose, but that service, that purpose, is going to evolve. Now. You know, interestingly, if you talk to a an architectural firm who specializes in designing bank branches, they're going to tell you that the branch model is here to stay and it's got to be, you know, at those two thousand square feed and it's got to have a you know, Ritun done is got to have this and that. Versus A A, you know, company that specializes in digital member acquisition, with digital member engagement, they will try and convince you their night that the brick and mortar models that then you've got to go a hundred percent digital. Somewhere in between there has to be a balance. We have found that the way that we approach our members and the way that we want to take care of her members and serve them, I'll relate our engagement with them really is done on a consultative concept and not not on a selling concept, and it's difficult to do that digitally. You can present products, you can highlight features, benefits, you can offer a seamless, easy way to sell the product or to fulfill the product to the to the consumer, to the member. But as far as consultation, one on one type of consultation, we have found that there continues to be great value in that one on one relation. Should ship, you know,...

...facebook, be don with their longdistance shine or relationships? We found a balance. I think we're still trying to figure out the right balance between the digital and the and the human touch. But I think branches I here to stay, but they will continue to evolve over time. Well, your use of the word evolved a couple times just makes me want to ask question. Evolved into? What do you think the the future of the branch looks like? I think the consultative topic is when I've heard a lot this idea of like how do I move my branch to more of an advisory capacity and less of a fulfilment, selling processing, you know, kind of transactional experience. But what do you think the branch is solve evolves into? Not to ask you to play architecture design die on the podcast real bit, but what does that what does it experience look like? What is it? Where does it go? If it's evolving from to wear, it's going to have to be a smaller footprint with a combination presence of digital and human. It doesn't have to be like I said, it doesn't. It will not be a five thousand square foot space unless you plan to have a somewhat of a community center. You allow folks throughout the community to come and hold meetings and that sort of thing, and I think I think we've seen some value in that as well. But I think eventually the branch is going to have to continue to and I'll use the same world again, to evolve based on the based on the consumer trends and based on what your local market needs. In some rural communities there's still great value in the facetoface and the personal relationships and in those communities, yeah, you do have to have more focus on that. So I think, Jeff, the key is to identify what your market needs are, and markets are unique one from the other. In short, once you've, once you figured out what your market needs, then you should be agile enough to to and you should be agile and flexible enough to where, in this part of the state or in this part of town, you you need to have a you know, three thousand square foot branch and in this part of the state you could go away with a thousand foot branch that has, you know, an interactive ATM that has ipads that you know we're members can transact and you have one or two employees that would help members with whatever they need. The idea of digitally transacting in the branch is really interesting and you both can provide digital technology and allow the customer. I've seen some some partners of ours that are putting qr codes or other ways for people to use their own the personal devices in the context of the branch to actually complete a transaction. And again maybe they're talking to a consultant around what's the right product or fit for me, but the actual fulfillment of that doesn't need to be necessarily human mediated or even completed in the moment. Right. And the idea of integrating either your the banks technology or the techonomy. Most of US bring a super computer into the end of the branch with us in our pocket, right. That's more K I always kind of tell my kids been watching like it's my kids are ranched in all the SPACEX stuff and in the launches and I and I go they send them into the moon and the computer that they to...

...do it was like a lot less powerful than this thing I hold in my pocket every day. It's kind of amazing what that technology is and we're bringing it everywhere and it gives you a footprint to leverage for that digital interaction that doesn't have to be provided by the institution and the context of the branch. So I didn't ask you one of the question before we get to some of the craziness stuff, which is, have you seen a shift? I know right now is an interesting environment as interest rates are rising. All the institutions, I know, are thinking about the kinds of product mix they want on their balance sheet. But I'm always interested about into your to your point about putting the customer experience, the consumers perspective, at the core of what you do. A shift in the products that consumers want versus like what we as institutions might think is strategically the right fit for our balance sheet. And there's obviously both of those are important. But if you seen I've been talking about, you know personal loans are growing largely by now pay later has kind of come out of nowhere to being a very big thing and I'm curious if you see any trends about the kind of products that consumers are looking for, that the kind of units that the different things we're seeing happening in the market? Yeah, absolutely. You know, we for the will past where three four years we've we've written the gravy train, you know, very nicely with the with a mortgage. We finance business. HMM, that means it's harder. When rights go up though, dragging the rates go up, that business starts to become hard and harder to grow, of course, and and that's where I was going with this. You know, when first one of these drates go up, we see the volume on home loans and lines of credit go up significantly. You know, we're just coming off of an absolute record first quarter at Kemba with home equity lending. So I can't say that, you know, we're seeing the decline in that business at all. But the more interesting one that you mentioned, Jeff, is the is the BNPL that by now pay later. Things on an absolute tear right now. In Two thousand and sixteen, and I'm trying to remember get my numbers right, in two thousand and sixteen, the BNPL payments accounted for less than point four percent of the total ecommerce business this year is going to be a three percent. That is an absolute huge increase. Europe actually is way ahead of us with this, with this channel. Finland twenty five percent of the population uses BNPL. Germany, twenty percent of all the ECOMMERCE pavements are made through pl. In the US this year we're looking at about forty nine billion dollars in ECOMMERCE. That would be that will go flow through the NPL. In Two thousand and twenty eight we're expecting that to be over four hundred billion. Now people like by now pay later for a lot of reasons. Number one, it's convenient. It's easy. You know how you got to do is click a button basically and you're done. There's no credit check, there's no whatever verification is done. Is that done on the back end, that it's done within two seconds. Some folks like it because it doesn't report to the Credit Buros.

Well, that is likely to change in the in the near future. As some resilition sustainable like writing along, it's more and more doubt moves there. It's that feels unsustainable as a strategy. Yep, absolutely, but I think the danger with BNPL is. It oftentimes puts people into payments that they cannot afford and they themselves don't think or don't know that they cannot afford. As as a trend itself as an industry, I absolutely love it and I think it's something that credit unions should definitely get involved with. Personal loans. You mentioned personal loans. You know, again another product that's that's been that has seen a very strong upswing for the last three or four years, again thanks to the experience of Flyntax, thanks to to the how thin text don't or ai in particular, has made lending more available, especially to the underserved, where traditional data is being used in credit decisions. So there should certainly is is a shift in the products. I think the biggest impact that we're going to see is is the BNPL. No doubt. Yeah, that's it's been a fascinating one and I've been curious to watch the rise because you talk about these of use and I kind of you know what I maybe I was an early skeptic. I thought, well, I got a credit card in my pocket. It's also pretty easy to use. It's not that challenging, but really interesting to see the adoption of BNPL. You know, replacing credit cards for some purchases and what it is is driving consumers to make that choice is really fascinating to me because it's it was not obvious to me that that simplicity of use was was that much of an upgrade from the status quo where, you know, credit card, my bike credit card works pretty well. Everywhere I go. They swipe it or not going to shove the inner, tap it or whatever, but it tends to do the job. But Hey, you know, be and pl is is a very popular product for Gen Z and a millennials. So we've got out. We've got to take care of it, we've got to address it, we got we got to be there and again, put that consumers desires at the center of what you do and find out, I mean, meet their needs. We were talking little bit before we started recording and you had mentioned crypto. I don't know what are your thoughts on the state of Crypto is as a credit union? Ohi I'm going to get into the CRYPTO game. You know what, where do you think that sets as it as it relates to the banking industry as a whole, not just the kind of wild wild west of your Meta mask quality. CRYPTOS here to stay. We need to we need to face that as as credit union executives that we need to accept that fact. CRYPTO is here to stay. The Way Crypto is regulated or not regulated today will change. There is talk now of having a US government back back crypto now with if that happens, or I should say when that happens, it will allow financial institutions to work with consumers to allow them to do more with the Crypto, because with the regulation is going to be a sense of higher sense of security by the credit unions or by the banks. If we were to use crypto today,...

...we would go through wor to offer such a service to our members. We would do it in the exact way, in the exact way that we allow them to buy stocks currently. Right you can buy a stock and you can use that stock as collateral for a loan. If you you know the OCK certificatet as collateral for a loan, you know at some point in the future, if we were to do that with crypto today, we would do it exactly the same way, but using that as collateral on alone would be highly doubtful because it really is very little reliability on the the value of that Crypto, depending on what it might be. I think it's here to stay. I think there are some credit unions, and know how you, who are looking at offering crypto, but again, you know, it would be in the form of a partnership with a a, you know, a coin base or or a Robin Hood or something something like that that would allow people to buy crypto through the Credit Union. There's still a lot at stake as far as reputation for credit unions and I think that's one of the one of the things that still sort of holds us back from from getting into that business, that a lot of people are still not sure what crypt is. They're still not sure how to how to make money on Crypto or how to invest in it, and we're still reluctant to put members that position. We're still, you know, we we have a feduciary responsibility really to to do what's right for the member and the crypto issue is still, it's the very still out on it, but I think eventually we're going to have to we're going to have to adopt and and and offer it. Yeah, I'm really interested in what happens when financial instuses. I think you're right most financial institutions that I've seen or in the cryptospace into you can buy it, you can sell it, you can hold it. You know, I haven't seen a lot moving to use it as collateral for a loan. All that certainly is possible to just custodial things you can do and cryptop make it really like, you know, truly collateralized in some more committed way. But I think the interesting thing will be to see if we, if we sert to see products or experiences built on top of Crypto that are not just buy and sell like an asset, but actually integrate into the experience. And I haven't seen any of that really happening yet. I mean we see it in web three outside of the financial services rule. But that'll be a really interesting thing to see what kind of developments happened where we're building on top of the blockchain, the crypto ecosystem to deliver new kinds of experience. Is Not just to hold some bitcoin or some etherium or some you know, die or whatever in your wallet and wouldn't eat. Wouldn't it be cool? Would you be nice to have a consumer make a payment on their loan with Crypto? Would be interesting I mean now that would that would really be something I have think. Do you know if we if we get to that point? I hope I'm still alive when we see, when we need to know point, but I think that would be just an absolutely awesome thing to see. Well, I think crypto is going to you know, so many things and when you think about change that, I think that old phrase it happens slowly and then all at once is true and we're in. We're in in this slowly part. But my guess...

...is the all at once is not that far away, where you start to see that certain things work, certain institutions adopt payment mechanisms or distribution into crypto or acceptance of Crypto in real time for payments of things. And Hey, if there are users who are holding a bunch of stuff in cryptone want to use that as a payment vehicle, than like. Also, I see the opposite now what people don't want to pay in Cryptoe. They want to do the opposite because they think crypto is going to keep appreciating and they don't. They don't want to sell their crypto to make a payment on a traditional asset. They'd rather use as collateral to borrow the money to do whatever it is they need to do because they're their believers and most of the holders are prompt. Other have these holdings or believers in the long term trend upwards of the of the valuation of those of those currencies. But it will certainly be an interesting time and my guess is the future is coming faster than we may think. Is that stuff starts some play out in the ruld Rick. I've got three questions that I used to end this podcast every week. Kind of gotten into a rhythm with them. I don't even have to have them runnen down anymore, but I figured I would ask those to you, to you now and get your opinions here before we in the conversation. And the first one is what's the best piece of career advice you've ever got? Career Advice? I would say never settle, never settle as good life. Every settle, not just career advice, as Crewe but I've never settle. Never accept the status quo. Always push the envelope. Just be careful, be careful all you. How far are you push the envelope? But yeah, I think that's that's probably the best clear advice that I ever that I ever got? Never settle. All right, I like it. That's what I tell my kids to never settle. Yeah. Second question, what's the best piece of advice you've ever gotten about consumer banker or consumer lending? Make Business Decisions and not credit decisions. This is something that I often work with my people on, with my with my team on, just because we have, you know, this matrix of credit guideline, guidelines between a Phi Co and a DTI and of this and of that. This is not the world. This is not the world that our members living this is not the world that consumers live in. There's a million other things that come into play when you make a decision or a credit decision, and I always encourage them, when I push them to make business decisions. I the first thing I was tell them is don't ever come to me and say I've got a member, I've got a six hundred member, or I've got I've got a seven hundred and fifty application. It did. This is not this is not the way to make credit decisions. This is not the way to evaluate whether you make alone or not. Look at the totality of the situation, look at the profile, understand, study and understand the profile of the album, can, regardless of what kind of you know loan it is, and make a business decision, not just a credit decision. If I if I'm going to make credit decisions twenty four hours a day, I don't need any human intervention. But we're no matter how digitize or how automated we get, we're still in the people business, we're still in the human business and we need to make decisions to really to take care of the folks that we serve. Interesting business decisions, not...

...credit decisions. I like it. And my last one. What's one bold prediction for the future? I think consumer lending? The future of consumer lending would really be in the hands of new market entrance who introduce more ai or better ai and and and better decisioning models. We're less and less emphasis is being placed on fight go scores and I think with that consumers in general will have more options and more power to manage their payments. I think the future of consumer lending really is going to be controlled by the consumer. They're going to dictate, and they have for the past several years. They're goinge to dictate to us how how we should run our business, not the other way around. All right, that's a pretty good bold prediction. To end on, Rick, I appreciate your taking the time enjoyment to day. Thanks so much, and I'm sure the guests will appreciate all your insights. Thank you, Jeff. It's good to be with you. Upstart partners with banks and credit unions to help grow their consumer loan portfolios and deliver a modern, all digital lending experience. As the average consumer becomes more digitally savvy, it only makes sense that their bank does to. Up Starts AI landing platform uses sophisticated machine learning models to more accurately identify risk and approve more applicants than traditional credit models, which fraud rates near zero. Up starts all digital experience would uses manual processing for banks and offers a simple and convenient experience for consumers. Whether you're looking to grow and enhance your existing personal and auto lenning programs or you're just getting started, upstart can help. Upstart offers an into end solution that can help you find more credit worthy borrowers within your risk profile, with all digital underwriting, onboarding, loan closing and servicing. It's all possible with upstart in your corner. Learn more about finding new borrowers, enhancing your credit decisioning process and growing your business by visiting UPSTARTCOM Ford Banks. That's upstartcom forward banks. You've been listening to leaders and lending from upstart. Make sure you never miss an episode. Subscribe to leaders and lending in your favorite podcast player using apple podcast. Leave us a quick rating by tapping the number of stars you think the show deserves. Thanks for listening. Until next time. The views and opinions expressed by the host and guests on the leaders and lending podcast are their own and their participation in this podcast does not imply an endorsement of such views by their organization or themselves. The content provided is for informational purposes only and the discussion between the host and guests should not be taken as financial advice by companies or individuals.

In-Stream Audio Search

NEW

Search across all episodes within this podcast

Episodes (78)